Hi guys,

i've only just joined birdline.. and to be honest about it.. its really making me rather sad. I curreny in a position where i'm thinking it might be best to try and get my babies re-homed.. but its so hard :-(

My story..

In 2003 i lost my father and in 2004 i lost my mother.. they had 3 parrots and cockateils. I'm the youngest in the family (none of us seem to get on) and have always been a soft touch.. although i work full time and occasionally long hours I was the one who felt compelled to take on the birds. Besides the fact that no one else would even though they had time to do so.

Anyway.. over the time i've had them i can tell that its had a detrimental effect on me personally (in someways and oviously positives in others). I've since been through a divorce and for the last 4 years have been living alone with my babies.

Work is a problem as i have to work away at times.. luckily i've put it off as much as possible but thats now getting to a point where i can no longer do so..

I've known the birds since they were born, and feel attached to them but realise thats its just getting to be too much work for me.. but is rehoming the best thing?? its hard to seperate my feelings from whats best for the birds. They are all well cared for (ok.. one of the plucks but has done since my parents went over board getting other parrots.. my mother was disabled so was always at home with them. They did have two other birds but sadly one passed away shortly after my father, and the other as my mother was ill.

I wouldn't really say any of the birds are particularly well socialised as my mother never did it when they were younger.. in fact now they aren't clipped.. i have to have them out in different rooms to avoid the conflicts another stress :-(

I really dont know what to do... i know i dont want the birds being moved from place to place.. as its not their fault at all... one of them is bonded to me.. and out of them all will break my heart to see her go..

I really need some advice and it would be nice to talk to someone perhaps having been in a similar position? I'm in spondon derbyshire and would love to hear from someone who can offer my a little advice.. and perhaps seperate the heart from the mind.

Jason.

Hi Jason,
First of all, whatever you decide, you took those birds on and should be proud of yourself for that, they could of ended up being given away to just any home where they wouldn`t be properly cared for.

What birds are they that you have? A little more info on the species and their ages may help.
Secondly, there is no shame in admitting the situation is wrong and you need help, whether that leads to you being able to keep one/some of them, or finding good homes for them makes no difference, it`s all about what`s best for the birds.

Are you sure they would fight if they were out together or is it just something you haven`t dared to try?

Maybe with some guidance on here on how to introduce a few things into your routine to make things easier you may feel better equipped to cope? The main thing is never to feel alone, everyone on this forum has a tale to tell and keeping animals is never easy.

Look forward to hearing a little more about the birds and your set ups.
Scarlett

OK.. and thankyou for a quick reponse. I'll tackle your points in order for ease of reading..

My flock is..
Katie - She's an african grey and is 15 years old, she is closely bonded to me..and although i refer to her as She.. as we have always done from birth.. she is actually a male lol.. surgically sexed. She is chipped and is very healthy, talkative and i'm able to handle her with ease.

Gemmi - He is a hawk headed amazon, he's 14 years old (i think? i have the birth cert.. but can't remember exacly). He talks but only a few words.. can be very very mischeivous and handles only on his terms.. i think fear has an awful lot to do with it.. he wont step up as appears to be frightful of hands.. again i think a combination of early training (or lack of) and the fact that my parents just didn't seem to do a great deal on interaction with them besides talking etc. He will come to me on request and flys to my shoulder so putting in the cage is done that way. He is very close to sammy the the pair of them defend one another which can be a problem in its self. Gemmi plucks his chest and back, his chest is pretty much bald.. he always has done since around 3 years old. He loves attention and i'm sure given enough of it.. he'd come round but at present the habbit is hard to break.

Sammy - She is a white front amazon, she's 14 years old (again i think lol). She doesn't talk although i try with her. She's probably the noisey one of the bunch but when alone (in another room away from gemmi) she's very quiet.. My parents never handled her at all.. and as such she is the least handleable. She will step up onto a ladder and has on occasion accepted my arm but only as a means to get back to the cage and back to gemmi. She is relatively healthy her plumage looks a little tattered as she seems to over preene (and helps regularly with gemmi to remove his feathers).

Poppy (male aged approx 5), Daisy and Rosie (both females aged approx 1) are all cockatiels. Daisy and Rosie were aquired to keep poppy company after loosing his/her lol.. mate.. bad move but still.. i'm a sucker for thinking he'd want another.


Ok.. as regards the help.. I dont have shame in asking for help.. but within the family they just haven't/wouldn't. I've a new partner now wel live separately.. and its also a no go there she's too scared, her children are too scared.. so my life revolves around early up to go see to my birds and give them time in the morning before work, work, home to see to the birds again and time before being covered, eat, see the girlfriend, bed .. repeat.. and quite simply its taking its toll.. with the added stress work is now added to the mix about having to work away.. i'm .. well i really dont know where i am :-(

Would they fight??? oh god yea.. Sammi defends gemmi by attack.. and all hell breaks loose.. I guess i could get them clipped again.. that did seem to calm them down a while but the lady who did it has sadly moved away. So the norm is that Katie will have more time with me on the deck or in another room, Gemmi and Sammi come out together in the living room (I have to keep checking on them as they will demolish the house given chance). the cockateils.. well Poppy will come out and have a fly around after the big ones have been covered but the newer two just haven't ventured out as yet..

I think my routine is pretty standard really.. the trouble is there isn't alot of time to play with.. i get them up at 7:00am ish.. sort out there food whilst i have them out.. (katie with me) then leave for work 8:30am. Back home around 6:00pm have them out as described above until around 7:00pm.. then cover them and let the little ones have a chance while i cook and eat.. usually around 9:00pm i leave to see my g/f.. most of the time to be honest i stay at her house it being 30mins away. Back to mine for 7:00am and cycle repeats... this is assuming i dont have to work on site, or away.. luckily a bridge i've not had to cross since divorce.. but looks like i'm not able to avoid it for much longer. Weekends are pretty similar but i clean out the cages in the morning on a sat.. which means the birds are out from maybe 10:00am until about 2:00pm... other than that.. the rest is very similar.

In a perfect world i'd have never gone out to aquire any pets knowing how my work life was.. but i just basically found myself in this position. and have been trying to cope since. Its not that i dont love them.. i do... but i'm struggling now i think more than ever as time goes on..

Jason.

Oh and setups??? i'm not sure what you mean about this but will be happy to talk about anything that might help..

Blimey, that is hard going!!!
By 'set ups' i basically meant what you have already answered, which bird comes out in which room and how your day works etc.
It is simply not fair that you have to live that way!!
Is there any way you could just keep Katie and maybe your girlfriend and children would come around to liking her and not being afraid?
The others it sounds like need a good home to go to, and I know you love them, that`s obvious by your post, but as you said, it`s just no way to live the way things are.

I`m sure Shell will help as she`s for your area and Birdline are very careful with home checks etc so would ensure a very good home for your birds.

Scarlett

Yes.. it is hard going.. i guess i didn't notice as much when I was totally alone as i had nothing else but the birds in my life anyway.. although the work problem would still arise..
I've emailed shell so hopefully we can talk.. and she can pass a little wisdom and divine light over..
I'm sure out of all of them.. Katie would be the easiest to get used to.. the practicalities of moving location all the time i'm not sure sure of though?
Would katie get used to living in two places for example? the last thing i want to do is have her upset.. in order to work with the early mornings / late evenings and continual travel it would be easier to have katie at my g/f's house in the week and with us at my house at the weekends? but how would she react to those changes? i know the're not keen on change.. would it/could it be made to seem like a trip/game? At present they rarely leave the house.. well aside from sitting with me on my deck (i've made the deck into a temporary avairy with removable panels to make it safe for them and still available for other uses should i need to.

these are my bigger birds... http://www.facebook.com/album.php?a...147b03f8da although they were clipped at that time.

Birds actually enjoy a routine but variation and what you are aying is that whilst she would be between your girlfriends and your house it wouldn`t be lots of disruption, it seems it would be a set arrangement?

I honestly think the situation could work very well and Katie may enjoy the variation, but you know her best so really only you could make that decision.

I am sure Shell will help work things out with you and hopefulyl everyone will be happier in the long run.
Scarlett

I hope so.. besides being my companions they are also the last link to my parents..

And yes.. it means she'd be living between the two houses effectively.. where ever i am.. so the faces would be the same.. i'll persure it and see what happens.. and yes.. shell and I have exchanged mails etc and will be talking soon hopefully and mutual time permitting.

In the meantime i'll continue you look and read.. and just carry on.. :-) but at least i feel maybe theres hope.. and looking at the birds at shell's if they are an example of rehomed birds then i at least have some comfort in that too :-)

Thankyou Scarlett.. for your replies, thoughts and assistance..

Jason

Jason.....I just wanted to say good luck with whatever you decide to do. It must be very difficult for you, especially, as you say, the birds are the last link to your parents........I will be following your posts and wish you well....x

Me too. I think your parents would be happy to know you are taking good care of their interests.
Scarlett

Jason,

I want to say that I feel for you - and now you've found BL you're not alone. Welcome. It's clear that you have done all in your power to do the best for your flock, but they are clearly hard work and it is not good for them or you if they are clearly causing you such stress and exhaustion. You've obviously been coping with them for a long time too.

I hope that Shell can offer you some practical advice and maybe a wing clip if you think your ammies would benefit. However, it is a big flock that you have there and with them not being friendly with each other, it only increases the work. When I read the details of your hectic life, like Scarlett, I wondered if it would be best for you to keep Katie and offer the others up for fostering. As you've admitted, you wouldn't have chosen to take on such a flock in your circumstances. It may feel like you'd be letting your parents down, but that simply isn't the case. The only way that you'd be letting them down is if you allowed the birds to suffer or be neglected. If you offered them for fostering you could stipulate that Gemmi and Sammy stayed together. From what you describe, they may be better suited to an aviary environment, but that assessment could be made by an ACO and/or safehouse.

As for the tiels, I'm sure they could be rehomed together, and then there'd be no need to worry about any clashes with your larger birds.

I'm not saying that rehomong is the best option, but should you decide to take it, then you be safe in the knowledge that they'd be going to like-minded parrot lovers, who had been homechecked and appropriately assessed for their suitability. See what Shell has to suggest and if you find things still aren't working, then consider it - not with shame but with the knowledge that you'd be offering them a secure environment and that you'd be doing your best to care for your parents' legacy.

As for Katie CAG, as you've said Greys like routine, but there's nothing to say that routine can't involve weekly 'adventures' in their travel cage to another special home, where she can be with her favoured human. I'm sure she'd love to travel with you regularly than be left behind. Our 2 BL CAGs don't like going into their travel cages, but once they are in them they don't mind the ride in the car. It's merely a matter of getting her used to it.

You don't say what work you do. Is there any chance that Katie could come to work with you or even travel with you when you have to stay overnight? (She'd need an appropriate wing-clip of course.) Just a thought.

Well, I don't know if I'd made any sense, I know I've rambled on a bit, but it really isn't the end of the world. Now you've found BL, there's always someone who will offer friendly advice and food for thought.

With best wishes, Helen

Thankyou both Lesley and Helen for your kind words of support and suggestions. I've put the idea to the g/f and will see how it goes.. but i wouldn't say it was jumped at as being a good idea from her.. we'll see i guess...
If i did consider allowing the others to be fostered would Katie be ok on her own in the house? I usually leave the Childrens TV channels on for them.. and i'm pretty sure during the day they merely wait for my return on the whole as my neighbours say they rarely make noises in the daytime...

I've yet to speak with Shell, but its on my list.. and yes.. i've had them all clipped once before.. which did make it a little easier.. as i could have them all out in the same room plus it did seem to remove a little of there independance which calms them down a touch (thinking mosly Sammy here..)
Wing clipping actually doesn't make a lot of difference to Gemmi.. he still managed to fly irrespective? lol i'm not sure how.. but it seems to always be the case.

As for avairy birds.. i'm not so sure.. maybe the tiels.. but certainly Gemmi loves human contact he can be very affectionate but he's VERY VERY touchy presumably through fear and poor socialising.. As for Sam, well she's always been a rogue but even her whilst in the cage showing how hard she can bite has recently tolerated a tickle on the tummy.. not much mind you.. that being said.. when she's away from Gemmi.. she will sit on your shoulder.. with only a slight hint of "I want to go back to my cage" when she's first there and when she's had enough.. I think Time is the key for them.. time and attention.. hopefully in time they will get what they deserve :-)

As for work.. well.. taking her maybe to a hotel room all day? i'm not so sure of.. I work as a software engineer and usually at present that is in the food/pharmaceutical and beverage type of environments... when on site... but in truth... whilst in the office... who knows? yes.. maybe thats possible?
I'm not sure she'd stay on a stand that long lol.. .patience hasn't been her strong point.. but the more i type.. the more i realise that the pace is dictated to me rather than driven by me??

Once again thankyou all.. and i'll keep up with the posts hopefully...

On another note.. i'll see if i can drag out some pics of the converted deck etc.. maybe some of you will find it an interesting idea for yourselves to have a make shift area outdoors where you can all go? Just a thought...

Jason,

Only you will know what will and won't work for you - suggestions are exactly that - ideas to consider. From what you say Gemmi and Sammy do sound more like companion birds. They may be better kept together but it would be worth considering separating them, for Gemmi's sake - again, only you can decide.

As for wing-clipping, there are several ways of doing it. BL only recommends clipping the primary feathers (the ones at the front/top of the wing, with the wing held out - and on BOTH sides only. This allows the bird to maintain their balance and to be able to flutter down to safety should they fall, but not to gain height. So, they can still fly a bit, but it takes a lot more effort. This type of clip grows out in around 6 months, depending on when the next moult is due. It should obviously only be done by an experienced clipper - as some of the primaries may be blood feathers, and clipping those could result in significant blood loss. It may be that your birds had this, or a different type of clip previously.

As for pictures of the deck - yes please - we love to see pics on here - and would appreciate seeing your wonderful flock too, if you have any photos . Top save web space, we all put phoitos on through personal photobucket (or similar) accounts.

Have a chat with Shell, take time and think things over - you don't need to rush these things and ask any more questions that come to mind. We're all here to help

Thanks again.. and yes.. thats how they were clipped in the past.. but like i say little gemmi clearly puts the effort in then as he still shot around the house like before pretty much hahaha..

I have put a link further up to my facebook pictures of the bigger birds, at the time i didn't have the cockatiels erm? i dont think??? seeing as you have a picture in your message i presure links can be embedded?? whats the HTML code for that on this site?? do you know and i'll link the pictures directly rather than needing to go through facebook :-)

the deck/avairy panel construction isn't on there though so will need to find those out. It took a bit of work to build.. but its safe and secure and allows them an element of freedom in the warmer weather :-)

Hmmm.. well here goes nothing... i'll try putting a pic on...
this all being well will be Katie..

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Ok.. after a bit of playing around i got the pics to go in.. :-)

This is Gemmi and Sammi..

Sammi

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Gemmi

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Together

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They are gorgeous birds - and in such good plumage - you are clearly looking after them well, even if it is such a massive struggle for you. And the java perch set up looks interesting and fun for birds. Don't rush making any decisions, think things over and ultimately be sure that you're doing the right thing for yourself and your flock x

Its a shame bout gemmin plucking though.. he has lovely maroon feathers on his chest.. (well did have years ago)..

The tree is a huge thing on a base with wheels and stuff.. and yea.. they like it.. there aren't lots of toys about out there mind.. but they have quite a few lol
And i've made a few here n there... ladders, bridges etc.. although only a few bridges are up in the house now.. lol..

Stunning birdies and a fab set up!!

Its a really tough decision you have to make and I know from the obvious care you take of your flock that you will make the right one.

If you decide to rehome through BL, it can sometimes be possible to maintain contact occasionally so that you can get updates on the birds.

I have fostered a BL ammie and I get regular e-mails from his human Dad and Nan for updates!! LOL I send pics and updates 2 or 3 time a year.

Vicky

Jason,

Just a thought about Gemmi's plucking. Do you give your flock regular multivits and calcium? Plucking can start with dietry deficiencies, although can turn into a bad habit - like biting your nails.May not help but certainly worth asking. Oh, and don't make the mistake of thinking that a plucked bird is necessarily an unhappy one. Everyone here knows that birds decide to go naked for a whole host of reasons - and we at BL are familiar with less than fully feathered birds. What's important is to make sure that there isn't a preventable cause underlying it.